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HOUSE OF COMMONS OF CANADA
35TH PARLIAMENT, 1st SESSION


JOURNALS

No. 236

Tuesday, October 3, 1995

10:00 a.m.



PRAYERS

DAILY ROUTINE OF BUSINESS

Tabling of Documents

Pursuant to Standing Order 32(2), Mr. Milliken (Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons) laid upon the Table, -- Government responses, pursuant to Standing Order 36(8), to the following petitions:

(1) No. 351-3421 concerning Indian affairs. -- Sessional Paper No. 8545-351-35D;

(2) No. 351-3730 concerning forestry. -- Sessional Paper No. 8545-351-145.

Presenting Reports from Inter-parliamentary Delegations

Pursuant to Standing Order 34(1), Mr. Dumas (Argenteuil-Papineau), presented the Report of the Canadian Group of the Inter-Parliamentary Union respecting the Special Session of the Inter-Parliamentary Council on the occasion of the 50th anniversary of the creation of the United Nations, held in New York from August 30 to September 1, 1995. -- Sessional Paper No. 8565-351-60E.

Presenting Petitions

Pursuant to Standing Order 36, petitions certified correct by the Clerk of Petitions were presented as follows:

-- by Mr. Bryden (Hamilton -- Wentworth), one concerning the Canadian Human Rights Act (No. 351-3889);

-- by Mr. Szabo (Mississauga South), one concerning the income tax system (No. 351-3890);

-- by Mr. Solomon (Regina -- Lumsden), one concerning the Senate (No. 351-3891) and one concerning hormone use in live stock (No. 351-3892).

GOVERNMENT ORDERS

The House resumed consideration of the motion of Mr. Dupuy (Minister of Canadian Heritage), seconded by Mr. Peters (Secretary of State (International Financial Institutions)), -- That Bill C-93, An Act to amend the Cultural Property Export and Import Act, the Income Tax Act and the Tax Court of Canada Act, be now read a second time and referred to the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage.

The debate continued.

The question was put on the motion and, pursuant to Standing Order 45, the recorded division was deferred until later today, at 5:00 p.m.

The House resumed consideration of the motion of Mr. Tobin (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans), seconded by Mr. Peters (Secretary of State (International Financial Institutions)), -- That Bill C-98, An Act respecting the oceans of Canada, be now read a second time and referred to the Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceans.

The debate continued.

MOTIONS

By unanimous consent, it was ordered, -- That no Private Members' Business shall be considered on Tuesday, October 3, 1995, and that at 5:30 p.m. it shall be deemed to be 6:30 p.m.

GOVERNMENT ORDERS

The House resumed consideration of the motion of Mr. Tobin (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans), seconded by Mr. Peters (Secretary of State (International Financial Institutions)), -- That Bill C-98, An Act respecting the oceans of Canada, be now read a second time and referred to the Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceans.

The debate continued.

The question was put on the motion and, pursuant to Standing Order 45, the recorded division was deferred until later today, at 5:00 p.m.

The Order was read for the consideration at report stage and second reading of Bill C-64, An Act respecting employment equity, as reported by the Standing Committee on Human Rights and the Status of Disabled Persons with amendments.

Pursuant to Standing Order 76(5), the Speaker selected and grouped for debate the following motions:

Group No. 1 -- Motions Nos. 1, 6, 8, 9, 10, 15, 16 and 17.

Group No. 2 -- Motion No. 4.

Group No. 3 -- Motion No. 5.

Group No. 4 -- Motion No. 7.

Group No. 5 -- Motion No. 11.

Group No. 6 -- Motions Nos. 13 and 14.

Group No. 1

Mr. McClelland (Edmonton Southwest), seconded by Mr. White (Fraser Valley West), moved Motion No. 1, -- That Bill C-64, in Clause 3, be amended by deleting lines 33 to 44, on page 2, and lines 1 to 6, on page 3.

Mr. McClelland (Edmonton Southwest), seconded by Mr. White (Fraser Valley West), moved Motion No. 6, -- That Bill C-64 be amended by deleting Clause 7.

Mr. McClelland (Edmonton Southwest), seconded by Mr. White (Fraser Valley West), moved Motion No. 8, -- That Bill C-64 be amended by deleting Clause 18.

Mr. McClelland (Edmonton Southwest), seconded by Mr. White (Fraser Valley West), moved Motion No. 9, -- That Bill C-64 be amended by deleting Clause 19.

Mr. McClelland (Edmonton Southwest), seconded by Mr. White (Fraser Valley West), moved Motion No. 10, -- That Bill C-64 be amended by deleting Clause 20.

Mr. McClelland (Edmonton Southwest), seconded by Mr. White (Fraser Valley West), moved Motion No. 15, -- That Bill C-64 be amended by deleting Clause 38.

Mr. McClelland (Edmonton Southwest), seconded by Mr. White (Fraser Valley West), moved Motion No. 16, -- That Bill C-64 be amended by deleting Clause 39.

Mr. McClelland (Edmonton Southwest), seconded by Mr. White (Fraser Valley West), moved Motion No. 17, -- That Bill C-64 be amended by deleting Clause 40.

Debate arose on the motions in Group No. 1.

STATEMENTS BY MEMBERS

Pursuant to Standing Order 31, Members made statements.

ORAL QUESTIONS

Pursuant to Standing Order 30(5), the House proceeded to Oral Questions.

GOVERNMENT ORDERS

The House resumed consideration at report stage and second reading of Bill C-64, An Act respecting employment equity, as reported by the Standing Committee on Human Rights and the Status of Disabled Persons with amendments;

And of the motions in Group No. 1 (Motions Nos. 1, 6, 8, 9, 10, 15, 16 and 17).

The debate continued on the motions in Group No. 1.

The question was put on Motion No. 1 and, pursuant to Standing Order 76(8), the record division, which also applies to Motions Nos. 6, 8, 9, 10, 15, 16 and 17, was deferred.

Group No. 2

Motion No. 4 was not proceeded with.

Group No. 3

Mr. McClelland (Edmonton Southwest), seconded by Mr. White (Fraser Valley West), moved Motion No. 5, -- That Bill C-64, in Clause 6, be amended by replacing line 9, on page 6, with the following:

    ``(b) to hire or promote any but the best qualified persons;''.

Debate arose on the motion in Group No. 3.

The question was put on Motion No. 5 and, pursuant to Standing Order 76(8), the recorded division was deferred.

Group No. 4

Mr. Ménard (Hochelaga-Maisonneuve), seconded by Mr. Paré (Louis-Hébert), moved Motion No. 7, -- That Bill C-64, in Clause 15, be amended by replacing lines 14 to 27, on page 10, with the following:

    ``(b) the preparation of the employer's employment equity plan.
      (2) Where the employees are represented by a bargaining agent, the bargaining agent shall participate in a consultation under subsection (1).
      (3) A consultation under subsection (1) is not a form of co-management.
      (4) The employer and its employees' representatives must implement and revise the employment equity plan jointly.''

Debate arose on the motion in Group No. 4.


At 5:00 p.m., pursuant to Standing Order 45, the House proceeded to the taking of the deferred recorded division on the motion of Mr. Dupuy (Minister of Canadian Heritage), seconded by Mr. Peters (Secretary of State (International Financial Institutions)), -- That Bill C-93, An Act to amend the Cultural Property Export and Import Act, the Income, Tax Act and the Tax Court of Canada Act, be now read a second time and referred to the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage.

The question was put on the motion and it was agreed to on the following division:



(Division--Vote No 342)

YEAS-POUR

Members--Députés

-- Adams -- Alcock -- Althouse -- Anawak -- Anderson -- Assad -- Assadourian -- Asselin -- Augustine -- Axworthy (Winnipeg South Centre/Sud-Centre) -- Baker -- Barnes -- Bélair -- Bélanger -- Bellehumeur -- Bellemare -- Bernier (Beauce) -- Bernier (Gaspé) -- Bernier (Mégantic -- Compton -- Stanstead) -- Bertrand -- Bethel -- Bevilacqua -- Bhaduria -- Blondin-Andrew -- Bodnar -- Bonin -- Boudria -- Brown (Oakville -- Milton) -- Bryden -- Caccia -- Calder -- Cannis -- Caron -- Catterall -- Chrétien (Saint-Maurice) -- Clancy -- Cohen -- Collenette -- Collins -- Comuzzi -- Cowling -- Crawford -- Culbert -- de Jong -- DeVillers -- Dhaliwal -- Dromisky -- Duceppe -- Duhamel -- Dumas -- Dupuy -- Easter -- Eggleton -- English -- Fewchuk -- Finlay -- Flis -- Fontana -- Fry -- Gaffney -- Gagliano -- Gagnon (Québec) -- Gallaway -- Gauthier -- Godfrey -- Godin -- Goodale -- Grose -- Guimond -- Harb -- Harper (Churchill) -- Harvard -- Hickey -- Hopkins -- Hubbard -- Ianno -- Iftody -- Irwin -- Jackson -- Jacob -- Jordan -- Keyes -- Kirkby -- Knutson -- Kraft Sloan -- Lalonde -- Landry -- Lastewka -- Laurin -- Lavigne (Beauharnois -- Salaberry) -- LeBlanc (Cape/Cap-Breton Highlands -- Canso) -- Leblanc (Longueuil) -- Lee -- Lefebvre -- Leroux (Richmond-Wolfe) -- Leroux (Shefford) -- Loney -- Loubier -- MacDonald -- Maclaren -- MacLellan (Cape/Cap-Breton -- The Sydneys) -- Malhi -- Maloney -- Marchand -- Marchi -- McCormick -- McGuire -- McKinnon -- McLaughlin -- McTeague -- McWhinney -- Ménard -- Mercier -- Mifflin -- Milliken -- Mitchell -- Murphy -- Murray -- Nunez -- O'Brien -- O'Reilly -- Pagtakhan -- Paré -- Parrish -- Patry -- Payne -- Peric -- Peterson -- Phinney -- Pickard (Essex -- Kent) -- Pillitteri -- Pomerleau -- Proud -- Reed -- Regan -- Richardson -- Rocheleau -- Sauvageau -- Scott (Fredericton -- York -- Sunbury) -- Serré -- Shepherd -- Sheridan -- Skoke -- Solomon -- St. Denis -- Steckle -- Stewart (Brant) -- Stewart (Northumberland) -- Szabo -- Taylor -- Telegdi -- Terrana -- Thalheimer -- Tobin -- Torsney -- Tremblay (Rimouski -- Témiscouata) -- Ur -- Valeri -- Venne -- Verran -- Volpe -- Wappel -- Wayne -- Wells -- Whelan -- Wood -- Young -- Zed -- 168

NAYS-CONTRE

Members--Députés

-- Breitkreuz (Yellowhead) -- Bridgman -- Chatters -- Cummins -- Duncan -- Epp -- Forseth -- Frazer -- Gilmour -- Grey (Beaver River) -- Grubel -- Hanger -- Harper (Calgary West/Ouest) -- Harper (Simcoe Centre) -- Hart -- Hayes -- Hermanson -- Hill (Prince George -- Peace River) -- Hoeppner -- Martin (Esquimalt -- Juan de Fuca) -- Morrison -- Penson -- Ramsay -- Ringma -- Schmidt -- Scott (Skeena) -- Silye -- Solberg -- Stinson -- Thompson -- White (Fraser Valley West/Ouest) -- Williams -- 36

Paired Members--Députés Pairés

-- Arseneault -- Bachand -- Bakopanos -- Beaumier -- Bélisle -- Bergeron -- Bouchard -- Brien -- Campbell -- Canuel -- Chrétien (Frontenac) -- Crête -- Dalphond-Guiral -- Daviault -- de Savoye -- Deshaies -- Dubé -- Dupuy -- Fillion -- Gagnon (Bonaventure -- Îles-de- -- la-Madeleine) -- Gerrard -- Godin -- Graham -- Gray (Windsor West/Ouest) -- Guay -- Langlois -- Lincoln -- Maheu -- Manley -- McLellan (Edmonton Northwest/Nord-Ouest) -- Minna -- Peters -- Picard (Drummond) -- Plamondon -- Robillard -- Speller -- Tobin -- Vanclief

Accordingly, the Bill was read the second time and referred to the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage.


Pursuant to Standing Order 45, the House proceeded to the taking of the deferred recorded division on the motion of Mr. Tobin (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans), seconded by Mr. Peters (Secretary of State (International Financial Institutions)), -- That Bill C-98, An Act respecting the oceans of Canada, be now read a second time and referred to the Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceans.

The question was put on the motion and it was agreed to on the following division:



(Division--Vote No 343)

YEAS-POUR

Members--Députés

-- Adams -- Alcock -- Althouse -- Anawak -- Anderson -- Assad -- Assadourian -- Augustine -- Axworthy (Winnipeg South Centre/Sud-Centre) -- Baker -- Barnes -- Bélair -- Bélanger -- Bellemare -- Bernier (Beauce) -- Bertrand -- Bethel -- Bevilacqua -- Bhaduria -- Blondin-Andrew -- Bodnar -- Bonin -- Boudria -- Brown (Oakville -- Milton) -- Bryden -- Caccia -- Calder -- Cannis -- Catterall -- Chrétien (Saint-Maurice) -- Clancy -- Cohen -- Collenette -- Collins -- Comuzzi -- Cowling -- Crawford -- Culbert -- de Jong -- DeVillers -- Dhaliwal -- Dromisky -- Duhamel -- Dupuy -- Easter -- Eggleton -- English -- Fewchuk -- Finlay -- Flis -- Fontana -- Fry -- Gaffney -- Gagliano -- Gallaway -- Godfrey -- Goodale -- Grose -- Harb -- Harper (Churchill) -- Harvard -- Hickey -- Hopkins -- Hubbard -- Ianno -- Iftody -- Irwin -- Jackson -- Jordan -- Keyes -- Kirkby -- Knutson -- Kraft Sloan -- Lastewka -- LeBlanc (Cape/Cap-Breton Highlands -- Canso) -- Lee -- Loney -- MacDonald -- Maclaren -- MacLellan (Cape/Cap-Breton -- The Sydneys) -- Malhi -- Maloney -- Marchi -- McCormick -- McGuire -- McKinnon -- McLaughlin -- McTeague -- McWhinney -- Mifflin -- Milliken -- Mitchell -- Murphy -- Murray -- O'Brien -- O'Reilly -- Pagtakhan -- Parrish -- Patry -- Payne -- Peric -- Peterson -- Phinney -- Pickard (Essex -- Kent) -- Pillitteri -- Proud -- Reed -- Regan -- Richardson -- Scott (Fredericton -- York -- Sunbury) -- Serré -- Shepherd -- Sheridan -- Skoke -- Solomon -- St. Denis -- Steckle -- Stewart (Brant) -- Stewart (Northumberland) -- Szabo -- Taylor -- Telegdi -- Terrana -- Thalheimer -- Tobin -- Torsney -- Ur -- Valeri -- Verran -- Volpe -- Wappel -- Wayne -- Wells -- Whelan -- Wood -- Young -- Zed -- 137

NAYS-CONTRE

Members--Députés

-- Asselin -- Bellehumeur -- Bernier (Gaspé) -- Bernier (Mégantic -- Compton -- Stanstead) -- Breitkreuz (Yellowhead) -- Bridgman -- Caron -- Chatters -- Cummins -- Duceppe -- Dumas -- Duncan -- Epp -- Forseth -- Frazer -- Gagnon (Québec) -- Gauthier -- Gilmour -- Godin -- Grey (Beaver River) -- Grubel -- Guimond -- Hanger -- Harper (Calgary West/Ouest) -- Harper (Simcoe Centre) -- Hart -- Hayes -- Hermanson -- Hill (Prince George -- Peace River) -- Hoeppner -- Jacob -- Lalonde -- Landry -- Laurin -- Lavigne (Beauharnois -- Salaberry) -- Leblanc (Longueuil) -- Lefebvre -- Leroux (Richmond -- Wolfe) -- Leroux (Shefford) -- Loubier -- Marchand -- Martin (Esquimalt -- Juan de Fuca) -- Mayfield -- McClelland (Edmonton Southwest/Sud-Ouest) -- Ménard -- Mercier -- Meredith -- Mills (Red Deer) -- Morrison -- Nunez -- Paré -- Penson -- Pomerleau -- Ramsay -- Ringma -- Rocheleau -- Sauvageau -- Schmidt -- Scott (Skeena) -- Silye -- Solberg -- Stinson -- Thompson -- Tremblay (Rimouski -- Témiscouata) -- Venne -- White (Fraser Valley West/Ouest) -- Williams -- 67

Paired Members--Députés Pairés

-- Arseneault -- Bachand -- Bakopanos -- Beaumier -- Bélisle -- Bergeron -- Bouchard -- Brien -- Campbell -- Canuel -- Chrétien (Frontenac) -- Crête -- Dalphond-Guiral -- Daviault -- de Savoye -- Deshaies -- Dubé -- Dupuy -- Fillion -- Gagnon (Bonaventure -- Îles-de-la-Madeleine) -- Gerrard -- Godin -- Graham -- Gray (Windsor West/Ouest) -- Guay -- Langlois -- Lincoln -- Maheu -- Manley -- McLellan (Edmonton Northwest/Nord-Ouest) -- Minna -- Peters -- Picard (Drummond) -- Plamondon -- Robillard -- Speller -- Tobin -- Vanclief

Accordingly, the Bill was read the second time and referred to the Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceans.

PROCEEDINGS ON ADJOURNMENT MOTION

At 5:28 p.m., pursuant to Standing Order 38(1), the question ``That this House do now adjourn'' was deemed to have been proposed.

After, debate, the question was deemed to have been adopted.

RETURNS AND REPORTS DEPOSITED WITH THE CLERK OF THE HOUSE

Pursuant to Standing Order 32(1), papers deposited with the Clerk of the House were laid upon the Table as follows:

-- by Mr. Tobin (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans) -- Report on the Administration and Enforcement of the Fish Habitat Protection and Pollution Prevention Provisions of the Fisheries Act for the fiscal year ended March 31, 1993, pursuant to section 11.1 of An Act to amend the Fisheries Act and to amend the Criminal Code in consequence thereof, Chapter 1, Statutes of Canada, 1991. -- Sessional Paper No. 8560-351-325. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceansro)

-- by Mr. Tobin (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans) -- Report on the Administration and Enforcement of the Fish Habitat Protection and Pollution Prevention Provisions of the Fisheries Act for the fiscal year ended March 31, 1994, pursuant to section 11.1 of An Act to amend the Fisheries Act and to amend the Criminal Code in consequence thereof, Chapter 1, Statutes of Canada, 1991. -- Sessional Paper No. 8560-351-325A. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceans)

ADJOURNMENT

At 5:35 p.m., pursuant to Order made earlier today, the House adjourned until tomorrow at 2:00 p.m., pursuant to Standing Order 24(1).