ACVA Committee Meeting
Notices of Meeting include information about the subject matter to be examined by the committee and date, time and place of the meeting, as well as a list of any witnesses scheduled to appear. The Evidence is the edited and revised transcript of what is said before a committee. The Minutes of Proceedings are the official record of the business conducted by the committee at a sitting.
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Minutes of Proceedings
Blake Richards moved, — That the committee resume the adjourned debate on his motion, as amended, moved on Wednesday, December 20, 2023.
The question was put on the motion and it was agreed to on the following recorded division:
YEAS: Rachel Blaney, Luc Desilets, Terry Dowdall, Blake Richards, Fraser Tolmie, Cathay Wagantall — 6;
NAYS: Sean Casey, Lisa Hepfner, Bryan May, Wilson Miao, Randeep Sarai — 5.
The committee resumed consideration of the motion , as amended, of Blake Richards moved on Wednesday, December 20, 2023, which read as follows:
That, in relation to its study on the National Monument to Canada's Mission in Afghanistan, the committee
(a) invite the Deputy Commander of Military Personnel, Lieutenant-General Lise Bourgon; and
(b) order the production of all memoranda, briefing notes, e-mails, correspondence or any other records of conversations or communications (including text messages, Microsoft Teams messages, WhatsApp messages, Signal messages or other electronic messaging), with regard to the National Monument to Canada's Mission in Afghanistan, transmitted, since May 1, 2014, between
(i) the Department of Veterans Affairs and the Office of the Minister of Veterans Affairs,
(ii) the Department of Canadian Heritage and the Office of the Minister of Canadian Heritage,
(iii) the Department of Veterans Affairs and the Privy Council Office, (iv) the Department of Canadian Heritage and the Privy Council Office,
(v) the Privy Council Office and the Office of the Prime Minister, (vi) the Office of the Minister of Veterans Affairs and the Office of the Prime Minister, and
(vii) the Office of the Minister of Canadian Heritage and the Office of the Prime Minister, provided that these documents shall be provided to the clerk of the committee, in both official languages and without redaction, within 21 days of the adoption of this motion.
(c) And that the Department of Veterans Affairs Canada and the Department of Canadian Heritage provide the official report of the jury established for the selection of the firm responsible for the design of the National Monument to Canada’s Mission in Afghanistan.
and of the amendment of Wilson Miao moved on Wednesday, February 28, 2024, which read as follows:
That, at the end of paragraph b), section (vii), the motion be amended by replacing the words “and without redaction” with the words “using the principles of the Access to information Act and Privacy Act”.
After debate, the question was put on the amendment of Wilson Miao and it was negatived on the following recorded division:
YEAS: Sean Casey, Lisa Hepfner, Bryan May, Wilson Miao, Randeep Sarai — 5;
NAYS: Rachel Blaney, Luc Desilets, Terry Dowdall, Blake Richards, Fraser Tolmie, Cathay Wagantall — 6.
Randeep Sarai moved, — That the motion be amended by removing, in paragraph (b), sections (iii) to (vii).
Debate arose thereon.
After debate, the question was put on the amendment of Randeep Sarai and it was negatived on the following recorded division:
YEAS: Sean Casey, Lisa Hepfner, Bryan May, Wilson Miao, Randeep Sarai — 5;
NAYS: Rachel Blaney, Luc Desilets, Terry Dowdall, Blake Richards, Fraser Tolmie, Cathay Wagantall — 6.
Sean Casey moved, — That the motion be amended by adding, after paragraph (b) (vii), the following: “(c) that the committee invite the Hon. Erin O’Toole, former minister of Veterans Affairs, to respond to questions about the selection of Richmond Landing site in 2014 for the National Monument to Canada’s Mission in Afghanistan, and specifically why Veterans were not properly consulted.”.
Debate arose thereon.
Lisa Hepfner moved, — That the debate be now adjourned.
The question was put on the motion and it was negatived on the following recorded division:
YEAS: Sean Casey, Lisa Hepfner, Bryan May, Wilson Miao, Randeep Sarai — 5;
NAYS: Rachel Blaney, Luc Desilets, Terry Dowdall, Blake Richards, Fraser Tolmie, Cathay Wagantall — 6.
The debate continued.
After debate, the question was put on the amendment of Sean Casey and it was agreed to.
The motion, as amended, read as follows:
That, in relation to its study on the National Monument to Canada's Mission in Afghanistan, the committee
(a) Invite the Deputy Commander of Military Personnel, Lieutenant-General Lise Bourgon; and
(b) order the production of all memoranda, briefing notes, e-mails, correspondence or any other records of conversations or communications (including text messages, Microsoft Teams messages, WhatsApp messages, Signal messages or other electronic messaging), with regard to the National Monument to Canada's Mission in Afghanistan, transmitted, since May 1, 2014, between
(i) the Department of Veterans Affairs and the Office of the Minister of Veterans Affairs,
(ii) the Department of Canadian Heritage and the Office of the Minister of Canadian Heritage,
(iii) the Department of Veterans Affairs and the Privy Council Office, (iv) the Department of Canadian Heritage and the Privy Council Office,
(v) the Privy Council Office and the Office of the Prime Minister,
(vi) the Office of the Minister of Veterans Affairs and the Office of the Prime Minister, and
(vii) the Office of the Minister of Canadian Heritage and the Office of the Prime Minister, provided that these documents shall be provided to the clerk of the committee, in both official languages and without redaction, within 21 days of the adoption of this motion.
(c) That the committee invite the Hon. Erin O’Toole, former minister of Veterans Affairs, to respond to questions about the selection of Richmond Landing site in 2014 for the National Monument to Canada’s Mission in Afghanistan, and specifically why Veterans were not properly consulted.
(d) And that the Department of Veterans Affairs Canada and the Department of Canadian Heritage provide the official report of the jury established for the selection of the firm responsible for the design of the National Monument to Canada’s Mission in Afghanistan.
The debate continued.
Lisa Hepfner moved, — That the committee do now adjourn.
The question was put on the motion and it was negatived on the following recorded division:
YEAS: Sean Casey, Lisa Hepfner, Bryan May, Wilson Miao, Randeep Sarai — 5;
NAYS: Rachel Blaney, Luc Desilets, Terry Dowdall, Blake Richards, Fraser Tolmie, Cathay Wagantall — 6.
The debate continued.
On motion of Luc Desilets, it was agreed, — That the sitting be suspended until Wednesday, March 20, 2024.
At 1:03 p.m., the sitting was suspended.
At 5:15 p.m., on Wednesday, March 20, 2024, the sitting resumed.
The debate continued.
Sean Casey moved, — That the motion be amended by adding after paragraph (d) the following: “(e) That the committee invite the National Capital Commission (NCC) in regards to their role in the construction of the National Monument to Canada’s Mission in Afghanistan to assure the committee that the project will respect established deadlines and that Afghanistan war veterans who wish to see the monument built quickly will not experience additional delays.”.
Debate arose thereon.
Rachel Blaney moved, — That the amendment be amended by replacing the words “the committee invite” with the words “the committee write a letter to”.
Debate arose thereon.
At 5:39 p.m., pursuant to Standing Order 115(5), the sitting was suspended.
At 6:33 p.m., the sitting resumed.
The debate continued.
The question: "That the committee do now adjourn" was put and was negatived on the following recorded division:
YEAS: Sean Casey, Lisa Hepfner, Tim Louis, Bryan May, Randeep Sarai — 5;
NAYS: Rachel Blaney, Luc Desilets, Terry Dowdall, Blake Richards, Fraser Tolmie, Cathay Wagantall — 6.
The debate continued.
The question was put on the subamendment of Rachel Blaney and it was agreed to on the following recorded division:
YEAS: Rachel Blaney, Lisa Hepfner, Tim Louis, Bryan May, Wilson Miao, Randeep Sarai — 6;
NAYS: Luc Desilets, Terry Dowdall, Blake Richards, Fraser Tolmie, Cathay Wagantall — 5.
The debate continued.
Randeep Sarai moved, — That the amendment be amended by adding after the words experience “additional delays.” the following: “. If the response is not satisfactory to the members of the committee then the NCC officials responsible be asked to appear before the Committee for no more than one meeting.”.
Debate arose thereon.
At 7:10 p.m., the sitting was suspended.
At 7:12 p.m., the sitting resumed.
The debate continued.
The question was put on the subamendment of Randeep Sarai and it was agreed to on the following recorded division:
YEAS: Rachel Blaney, Sean Casey, Lisa Hepfner, Bryan May, Wilson Miao, Randeep Sarai — 6;
NAYS: Luc Desilets, Terry Dowdall, Blake Richards, Fraser Tolmie, Cathay Wagantall — 5.
Lisa Hepfner moved, — That the committee proceed to sit in camera.
The question was put on the motion and it was negatived on the following recorded division:
YEAS: Sean Casey, Lisa Hepfner, Tim Louis, Bryan May, Randeep Sarai — 5;
NAYS: Rachel Blaney, Luc Desilets, Terry Dowdall, Blake Richards, Fraser Tolmie, Cathay Wagantall — 6.
The debate continued.
On motion of Blake Richards, it was agreed, — That the debate on his motion, as amended, moved on Wednesday, December 20, 2023, be adjourned until the review of the report on the study of the experience of women veterans is completed; that, in relation to the study on transition to civilian life, the committee hold the meeting with witnesses that has been postponed; and, that the committee then resume debate on his motion.
At 8:00 p.m., the committee adjourned to the call of the Chair.